@Elena Gross : 我从14岁起就遭受严重的偏头痛折磨，这直接促使我投身神经科学研究，致力于寻找有效的偏头痛治疗方法。我的偏头痛非常剧烈，对光、声音和气味都极其敏感。我尝试过各种治疗方法，包括药物治疗和替代疗法，但收效甚微。在攻读博士学位期间，我偶然发现禁食模仿饮食对癫痫患者有效，这启发我研究酮类饮食对偏头痛的影响。我发现酮类饮食显著改善了我的偏头痛症状，但严格的酮类饮食会对身体造成一些负面影响。因此，我开发了一种医疗食品Brain Ritual，它包含外源性酮体和多种微量营养素，可以帮助改善大脑能量代谢，从而缓解偏头痛。Brain Ritual的服用方法取决于个人的胃肠道耐受性，可以空腹服用，也可以在饭后服用。目前尚不清楚外源性酮体与碳水化合物的最佳摄入比例，以及最佳服用时间。我建议在服用外源性酮体时，搭配低血糖指数的全食物饮食。我个人需要每天服用Brain Ritual来控制偏头痛，但持续服用两年半后，我的身体已经适应了，不需要每天都服用。Brain Ritual的最佳服用方案因人而异，需要根据个人的耐受性和反应进行调整。许多使用者需要逐渐增加Brain Ritual的服用量，以适应其成分。许多人需要时间来适应外源性酮体，因为他们的身体可能多年没有接触过酮体。Brain Ritual适用于代谢性偏头痛患者，但不适用于所有偏头痛患者，例如激素性偏头痛患者。患有某些疾病，例如I型糖尿病、先天性代谢疾病或严重肾衰竭的患者不应服用Brain Ritual。服用Brain Ritual前，建议咨询医生，特别是对于正在服用其他药物的患者。Brain Ritual中的成分是人体自身可以利用的，因此对肝脏负担较小。高浓度的酮体可能会抑制内源性酮体的产生，但Brain Ritual的剂量不会产生这种影响。外源性酮体很难过量，安全性较高。大多数偏头痛患者需要两到三周的时间才能感受到Brain Ritual的效果。Brain Ritual可能对癌症患者有一定的益处，但不能作为单一疗法。酮体与葡萄糖在细胞内的吸收和代谢存在竞争，酮体优先被大脑利用。酮体可以抑制肝脏的糖异生作用，从而降低血糖水平。对于健康人群，建议在每餐都摄入少量酮体，以保持代谢灵活性。保持代谢灵活性对健康至关重要，这可以通过周期性地摄入酮体和碳水化合物来实现。 @Richard Jacobs : 作为访谈者，Richard Jacobs主要负责引导话题，提出问题，并对Elena Gross的回答进行总结和补充。
十四岁那年，剧烈的偏头痛第一次袭击了我。这种单侧搏动性头痛，伴随对光、声、味的高度敏感，彻底改变了我的生活。 那感觉就像置身于装满上千瓶香水的小房间，令人作呕，甚至疼痛难忍。 这种超敏反应源于神经元过度活跃，如同癫痫发作一般。 普通的刺激，比如荧光灯，都可能引发剧痛。 我深知这种痛苦，因为我亲身经历了二十年。
我尝试过各种治疗方法，从抗癫痫药物到针灸、中药，但效果甚微。 药物的副作用甚至让我差点烧毁宿舍——因为忘记了正在煮土豆。 那段日子，我饱受痛苦折磨，学业也岌岌可危。
转机出现在我攻读心理学硕士学位期间。 一次偶然的机会，我发现了禁食模仿饮食疗法，它能显著减少癫痫患者的发作。 这启发我研究酮类饮食对偏头痛的影响。 我开始进行自我实验，发现当大脑处于酮症状态时，偏头痛症状明显减轻，如同拨云见日。 然而，严格的酮类饮食会让我感到身体迟钝。
于是我决定将此作为博士论文的研究方向。 起初，牛津大学认为我的研究方向过于冒险，缺乏数据支持。 我毅然放弃了牛津的奖学金，转而前往瑞士巴塞尔，在那里，我的研究最终获得了成功。 我完成了首个使用外源性酮体的临床试验，并获得了专利。 然而，大型制药公司对我的研究成果并不感兴趣。
凭借着对研究的执着和对患者的责任感，我创立了公司，并最终推出了医疗食品Brain Ritual。 这款产品包含外源性β-羟基丁酸酯（占配方50%）、多种微量营养素、电解质和抗氧化剂等，旨在解决偏头痛患者的代谢缺陷和营养缺乏问题。 Brain Ritual帮助我将每月偏头痛发作次数从20天减少到1天，让我重获新生。
Brain Ritual是一种粉末状产品，溶于水中饮用。 服用时间并非一成不变，取决于个人的胃肠道耐受性。 有些人可以空腹服用，有些人则需要在饭后服用，甚至可以分次饮用。 我最初需要每天服用Brain Ritual来维持酮症状态，控制偏头痛。 但两年半后，我的身体已经适应了，不再需要每天服用。
目前，我们正在进行抑郁症临床试验，因为我们发现神经精神疾病之间存在许多共同的代谢问题。 未来，我们还将探索Brain Ritual在长寿领域的应用。
关于Brain Ritual的最佳服用方案，并没有一个放之四海而皆准的答案。 它取决于个人的身体状况和对成分的耐受性。 许多使用者需要循序渐进地增加服用量，让身体逐渐适应。 这与酮适应期有关，因为许多人的身体多年未接触过酮体。
Brain Ritual主要针对代谢性偏头痛患者，即偏头痛是由于能量代谢或营养缺乏引起的。 但它并不适用于所有偏头痛患者，例如激素性偏头痛患者。 患有I型糖尿病、先天性代谢疾病或严重肾衰竭的患者也不应服用。 服用前，务必咨询医生，特别是正在服用其他药物的患者。
Brain Ritual中的成分是人体自身可以利用的，对肝脏负担较小。 高剂量的酮体可能会抑制内源性酮体的产生，但Brain Ritual的剂量不会产生这种影响。 它很难过量，安全性较高。
大多数患者需要两到三周才能感受到效果。 Brain Ritual可能对癌症患者有一定的辅助作用，但不能作为单一疗法。 酮体与葡萄糖在细胞内的吸收和代谢存在竞争，酮体优先被大脑利用。 酮体可以抑制肝脏的糖异生作用，降低血糖水平。
对于健康人群，建议在每餐都摄入少量酮体，以保持代谢灵活性。 这可以通过周期性地摄入酮体和碳水化合物来实现，模拟我们祖先在不同季节摄入不同食物的模式。 这有助于恢复身体的代谢灵活性，如同将我们的身体从“电动汽车”转变为“混合动力汽车”。
Brain Ritual目前可在brainritual.com购买。 更多关于代谢和偏头痛的信息，请访问drelenagross.com或关注我的社交媒体账号。
Finding Genius Podcast⋅
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01:46 我14岁开始遭受偏头痛的困扰，各种感官刺激都会加剧疼痛，这促使我深入研究偏头痛和神经科学。
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02:14 偏头痛患者对感官刺激高度敏感，就像置身于充满大量香水的气味中一样难受。
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02:27 偏头痛患者的神经元放电过快过强，导致正常刺激都可能造成疼痛。
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02:51 强烈的香味，例如香水，会加剧偏头痛，甚至诱发头痛。
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03:20 香水中的化学物质可以通过鼻腔进入大脑，损害血脑屏障，对健康有害，偏头痛患者尤为敏感。
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04:01 香水中的毒素会累积在体内，对健康造成长期损害，尤其是对于代谢能力较弱的人群。
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04:25 近几十年来，环境中的毒素越来越多，这可能是导致神经系统疾病发病率上升的原因之一。
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04:45 许多新化学物质的长期影响尚不清楚，而香水等产品甚至不受监管。
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05:59 避免接触毒素和氧化应激对大脑健康至关重要，这不仅对偏头痛患者，也对所有人都有益。
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06:13 我长期遭受偏头痛的困扰，并且发现偏头痛的研究和治疗远远不足。
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07:01 长期服用强效药物治疗偏头痛导致严重的副作用，这促使我寻找更有效的治疗方法。
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07:56 我偶然发现禁食模仿饮食对癫痫有效，这启发我研究酮类饮食对偏头痛的影响。
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08:39 酮类饮食改善了我的偏头痛症状，但严格的酮类饮食会对身体造成一些负面影响。
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09:05 牛津大学最初认为我的酮类饮食研究风险太大，但我在瑞士巴塞尔完成了这项研究并获得了博士学位。
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10:21 我开发了一种医疗食品，它通过补充营养物质来改善大脑能量代谢，从而缓解偏头痛。
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10:45 这种医疗食品帮助我将偏头痛发作次数从每月20天减少到1天，并让我能够胜任全职工作。
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12:21 由于肝脏问题，我从严格的酮类饮食转向了外源性酮体补充剂。
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13:17 我的产品Brain Ritual包含多种成分，包括外源性酮体和多种微量营养素，可以溶于水中饮用。
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13:42 Brain Ritual的服用方法取决于个人的胃肠道耐受性，可以空腹服用，也可以在饭后服用。
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18:29 目前尚不清楚外源性酮体与碳水化合物的最佳摄入比例，以及最佳服用时间。
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19:15 在需要最佳认知功能的情况下，将外源性酮体与碳水化合物结合可能会有益。
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19:52 身体同时燃烧葡萄糖和酮体，只是比例不同，而酮类饮食只是改变了主要能量来源。
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21:15 外源性酮体可以帮助调节酮体与葡萄糖的比例，从而优化大脑功能。
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22:12 建议在服用外源性酮体时，搭配低血糖指数的全食物饮食。
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23:22 酮体与葡萄糖的最佳比例取决于个人的基因和环境因素，以及其葡萄糖代谢能力。
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24:15 Brain Ritual的最佳服用时间取决于个人的胃肠道耐受性，可以饭前或饭后服用。
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25:57 我个人需要每天服用Brain Ritual来控制偏头痛，但持续服用两年半后，我的身体已经适应了，不需要每天都服用。
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26:42 Brain Ritual的最佳服用方案因人而异，需要根据个人的耐受性和反应进行调整。
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27:04 许多使用者需要逐渐增加Brain Ritual的服用量，以适应其成分。
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27:51 许多人需要时间来适应外源性酮体，因为他们的身体可能多年没有接触过酮体。
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28:40 Brain Ritual适用于代谢性偏头痛患者，但不适用于所有偏头痛患者，例如激素性偏头痛患者。
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29:35 Brain Ritual主要针对代谢性偏头痛患者，但对其他类型的偏头痛患者也可能有一定的益处。
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30:04 患有某些疾病，例如I型糖尿病、先天性代谢疾病或严重肾衰竭的患者不应服用Brain Ritual。
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31:01 服用Brain Ritual前，建议咨询医生，特别是对于正在服用其他药物的患者。
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31:24 Brain Ritual中的成分是人体自身可以利用的，因此对肝脏负担较小。
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32:01 高浓度的酮体可能会抑制内源性酮体的产生，但Brain Ritual的剂量不会产生这种影响。
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33:10 外源性酮体很难过量，安全性较高。
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33:31 大多数偏头痛患者需要两到三周的时间才能感受到Brain Ritual的效果。
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35:24 Brain Ritual可能对癌症患者有一定的益处，但不能作为单一疗法。
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37:19 酮体与葡萄糖在细胞内的吸收和代谢存在竞争，酮体优先被大脑利用。
◉
38:12 酮体可以抑制肝脏的糖异生作用，从而降低血糖水平。
◉
39:56 对于健康人群，建议在每餐都摄入少量酮体，以保持代谢灵活性和能量平衡。
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41:18 保持代谢灵活性对健康至关重要，这可以通过周期性地摄入酮体和碳水化合物来实现。
00:00
Forget frequently asked questions. Common sense, common knowledge, or Google. How about advice from a real genius? 95% of people in any profession are good enough to be qualified and licensed. 5% go above and beyond. They become very good at what they do, but only 0.1%. 语法解析
00:16
Richard Jacobs has made it his life's mission to find them for you. He hunts down and interviews geniuses in every field. Sleep science, cancer, stem cells, ketogenic diets, and more. Here come the geniuses. This is the Finding Genius Podcast with Richard Jacobs. 语法解析
00:37
Hello, this is Richard Jacobs with the Finding Genius podcast. My guest today is Elena Gross. She's a neuroscientist, founder and CEO. We're going to talk about the topic of migraines and hopefully how to relieve them, maybe prevent them, maybe stop them from happening for sufferers. We'll see. She's the founder of KetoSwiss and MigraCat. I don't know if I pronounced it right. BrainVirtual, we just rebranded to call the brand BrainVirtual because it's easier to pronounce. MigraCat is quite a mouthful. Okay. 语法解析
01:06
Okay, so the founder of Keto Swiss and Brain Ritual. Okay, very good. Well, welcome to the podcast. Thank you so much for being here. Yeah, tell me about your background. Why are you interested in migraines and neuroscience? You know, unfortunately, a lot of people have personal experience with stuff like that, and that's why. So I'm guessing that's what's happening with you. Yeah, so… 语法解析
01:24
Everything I studied almost was due to me personally suffering from these severe headaches. So when I was around 14, I started getting these unilateral, so one-sided, very severe pulsating headaches with light started to hurt, noises hurt, smells hurt as well. So even like really sensitive to any kind of odor and… Smells hurt? 语法解析
01:46
That you'd smell something and it would make your head hurt? Yeah, you smell something and it's very uncomfortable. It makes you nauseated and it almost hurts. It's hard to describe. And also the light is too bright. Any sensory input is basically too intense. It's difficult to say for somebody who has an experience. Maybe think about this being like a thousand bottles of perfume in one room, right? And you're in there. At some point, you're probably getting sick and it's too much, right? So my brain actually… 语法解析
02:14
is you're very hypersensitive because your neurons, a bit like epilepsy, they fire too quickly and too much. So that can mean that just normal benign stimuli like a bright light or a fluorescent light in a hospital or a shop 语法解析
02:27
All of this can be almost painful. Like when I've been in the mall, you know, those fragrance stores, I run by them because they smell so, so strong. It makes me sick. Yes, exactly that. And then if you have migraine, that can even trigger the headache after. All right. So like these fragrances and we can get into that because the fragrance is actually, it's a very interesting thing, but I'm getting ahead of myself. But I just want to add that anything that goes through your nose, in your nose, the 语法解析
02:51
the blood-brain barrier that is usually protecting you quite well from toxins is broken. Otherwise, you wouldn't smell. So for you to smell, molecules actually have to get very close to the neurons so you can fire an extra potential and smell something. But that also means that there's a loophole. So toxins that make it through the air can go directly to your brain. And so that's why perfumes, and I'm going to put this right out here, perfumes are going to be the next smoking. Most people don't know yet. 语法解析
03:20
have 50% of perfumes have toxic substances. And the migraineurs in that sense are the canaries in the coal mine, right? So if you run past these shops, you're doing something good for your brain, for sure. Really? So some of the chemicals in a perfume… 语法解析
03:35
have negative health effects, so people that wear perfume are around it, it makes them sick over time? Yes. And well, potentially, there's always an interaction between your environment and your genetics, right? So if you are a super detoxer genetically, right, you might be able to get rid of that stuff before it accumulates in large quantities. But if you're not, and that's my case, right, if you cannot get rid of these toxins that make it into your brain and body, 语法解析
04:01
as quickly as you gather more, then you're accumulating and then you will get sick. So as most of us don't know, it's better to be on the safe side than getting, I don't know, dementia or some kind of neurodegeneration later on in life. So I would definitely are on the safe side and especially with children, you know, a lot of things like ADHD, you know, autism, all of these neuro diseases, even depression, all of these things 语法解析
04:25
is really increasing over the last couple of decades, right? And one of the things I strongly believe is that toxins are just more and more ubiquitous in these days, this world, right? So the last 50 or so years, we have introduced 80,000 new chemicals into the world. And not- We don't know the effects of them. 语法解析
04:45
for example, and don't exactly know what they do, right? And they're out there. And then in the US, at least, the principle is, right, you first can start selling it usually, right? And only once you have gathered enough data that it's doing harm, then you have to stop selling that. And the big problem is perfumes aren't even regulated. Foods are regulated, but perfumes are not. Odors are not. And in this day and age, we expect everything to kind of last for 24 hours. Your deodorant, your 语法解析
05:13
washing up liquid, your detergent. All these smells are supposed to linger around for a very long time, which means they need to be attached to more molecules that can make it into the brain. And that's like a whole topic in and of itself that we could probably talk about for 30 to 40 minutes and for the whole podcast. 语法解析
05:30
But yeah, just since you asked, I wanted to say be careful on, and that's one of the pillars. One thing we'll talk about migraine, but that's good for general brain health. So a lot of things I talk about from a more personal migraine perspective actually turns out to be pretty good for the brain in general. And that's one of the pillars is definitely also about toxins and oxidative stress. So watching out for toxins in the air, in the water, in the food and so on. But yeah, maybe keeping my background quote since we're already getting into the good stuff. 语法解析
05:59
I started to have this odd migraine headaches. Nobody could diagnose it for at least a year. So that's odd because it's so common. And then I thought, oh, wow, there's a billion people in the world that have migraines. So it's one in seven. Surely we know what it is and what to do about it, right? The 语法解析
06:13
should have been so much research on that topic. But that couldn't be further from the truth. Nobody could really tell me. And I spent two decades literally going from specialist to specialist. I tried all the things on the drug side of things like anti-epileptic drugs and so on, terrible side effects to alternative things like, you know, acupuncture and Chinese herbal medicine and whatever. But nothing really made me better. So I started studying psychology. And when I was halfway through my degree, 语法解析
06:40
I was chronic. Chronic migraine meaning 20 days of migraine a month. Completely in pain. Almost all the time. Overeating medication. I was on anti-epileptic drugs that were so strong that I forgot the name of my best friend over coffee and I nearly burned down the college dorm in Oxford actually. I put on potatoes. You know, they have a lot of water. So it's… 语法解析
07:01
It's incredible. And then I completely forgot that I wanted to have lunch and I went for a run. And I came back and there was smoke everywhere. You know, I almost, these potatoes were charcoal. And that's when I decided, you know, this can't be how I need to, how I have to live my life. You know, I was afraid of failing every exam. I know Oxford is tough as it is, right? But if you're on a drug, it makes you demented. It was just, it was a horrible time. But… 语法解析
07:29
At the end of my degree, I stumbled across something and I think it must have been fate, procrastinating from my second master's thesis. I stumbled across the oldest treatment for epilepsy. And that turns out to be a fasting mimicking diet. Because people found out 150 plus years ago that when you put epileptic patients on a fast, the seizures are reduced drastically. But you can't fast anyone forever, right? So that's when they tried to imitate fasting in a diet. And 语法解析
07:56
And today that concept has been a bit butchered sometimes, but it's generally known as a ketogenic diet because during fasting, the body produces ketone bodies as an alternative energy for the source for the brain. Meeting upon that mechanisms at the time, it 语法解析
08:11
It all sounded so my very relevant. So I was amazed. There was no info back then, really. So I tried like a lot of self-experiments. Finally, when my brain was in ketosis, it was like clouds lifting. I felt like a crystal clear Swiss mountain lake. I'm now living in Switzerland, right? So it was amazing, but it was hard to adhere to. And the rest of my body felt a bit sluggish and off. So long story short, I knew I wanted to do this in my PhD. 语法解析
08:39
Oxford said it's way too risky. So just finishing my bio, I did a master's in neuroscience in Oxford and then I changed to actually Switzerland, Basel in tiny Switzerland out of all places. What do you mean it's too risky? They said it's too risky because there was no data at the time that this would work, right? So in Oxford, you have to produce them. And they were like, oh, there's like, this is so new. There's no data. What if there's no results, right? Then you won't get a PhD or you need to do something else or… 语法解析
09:05
So they said, no, you can't do this here. You need to do your neuroimaging on this certain drug, whatever, in migraine that was planned. And that was a tough decision for me because I had a stipend there. But I turned it down and I think it was the right decision for sure. Because in tiny Basel, Switzerland, they said if you drop Oxford and come here, you can do it as a side project. 语法解析
09:26
And I did, and the data was promising. And in the end, I do have a PhD out of it. We did the first clinical trial in patients using exogenous ketone bodies in Basel, Switzerland, that resulted in a PhD, eventually the first patent. And Wendell Vardes, Roche, and so on weren't interested in doing anything about it. Even though I have zero business background and I didn't know what that even means, I eventually had the courage and found this startup. 语法解析
09:50
did some more research. We had the first pattern. And then eventually, eventually, after several years in finishing the PhD, 语法解析
09:57
We now just launched last June in the U.S. with a medical food. A medical food is something between a supplement and a drug. So it's safe ingredients, but against a disease, in this case migraine. All safe ingredients with research behind it where we address the metabolic shortcomings or the metabolic deficiencies, nutrient deficiencies in migraine. And this is what gave me my brain back because migraine and epilepsy are related. 语法解析
10:21
So what we know was working from ketogenic diets in epilepsy, we kind of have now at least partially replicated in a product to give the brain its energy back. And for me, migraines were warning me from energy deficiency. And I have my life back now. I'm down from like 20 days to one. I was never even imagining that I could do a full time job, but now I'm doing like 150%. 语法解析
10:45
Running a startup, you know, with everything that it entails. That's going cool. I'm super grateful. You know, I already won and now we want to help other patients. We're running a depression trial now because it turns out that neuropsychologic diseases have a lot in common. At least a subgroup has these metabolic energy deficiency issues. So we're now extending to mental diseases and also longevity in the future as well. 语法解析
11:10
Before we continue, I've been personally funding the Finding Genius podcast for four and a half years now, which has led to 2,700 plus interviews of clinicians, researchers, scientists, CEOs, and other amazing people who are working to advance science and improve our lives and our world. Even though this podcast gets 100,000 plus downloads a month, we need your help to reach hundreds of thousands more worldwide. Please visit findinggeniuspodcast.com and click on support us. 语法解析
11:36
We have three levels of membership from $10 to $49 a month, including perks such as the ability to see ahead in our interview calendar and ask questions of upcoming guests, transcripts of podcasts you're interested in, the ability to request specific topics or guests, and more. Visit FindingGeniusPodcast.com and click support us today. Now back to the show. 语法解析
11:56
Do you depend on, do you go on a ketogenic diet or will you just answer if I'm exogenous ketones? Yes, initially, yes. And I was traveling quite a bit because in migraine, you see, I had been on a high dose of medication for over a decade and my liver was struggling. So when you're on a strict ketogenic diet, your liver has the prominent ketone body producer, right? The primary ketone body production site. 语法解析
12:21
My liver was struggling and I think it still is. So a strict ketogenic diet was not feeling right long term for me. This is when I turned to exogenous ketone bodies. So what we are using is the human identical version, the D-beta-hydroxybutyrate attached to some minerals that play a role in migraine as well, like magnesium and so on. What does that mean though? Are you supplementing with them on an empty stomach? Is it a meal replacement? Is it an additional… Yeah, great question. Great question. So… 语法解析
12:49
This product is now called Brain Ritual and it basically has over 30 ingredients. One of them is this beta-hydroxybutyrate that makes up about 50% of the formulation. But then we also have all the micronutrients, electrolytes, antioxidants and all this other good stuff, trace minerals that our foods and soils can be deprived of and that play a role in migraine. All in one sachet. So it's a sachet you dissolve in water. And now how you take it depends a bit on how strong 语法解析
13:17
strong your gastrointestinal tract is right so it's a lot of nutrients and minerals so if you're sensitive you shouldn't be drinking it on an empty stomach because that will probably cause diarrhea but then you would take it with or after food if you have a strong stomach and after some like ramping up and getting used to it you can also take it on an empty stomach fasting it also depends on on your your goals and your dietary can you intermittent fast then of course you can take it five 语法解析
13:42
fasted. So with exogenous ketone bodies makes fasting maybe a little bit easier. If you are sensitive and you can't fast because you still have chronic migraines, then maybe don't. You can also sip it throughout the day. It's very stable in water. So you can just mix it in the morning and then have a couple of sips while you get through the day. At current it's orange flavor, but we also have different flavors coming up very soon. 语法解析
14:06
I'd encourage you to do a no-flavor one, because I did a lot of exactos ketones for a while, and the flavor ones are horrifically disgusting. You had to have a large volume of them. So what I would do is I would get this one called Keto Force, which had no flavor. It was even worse. But what? You were… 语法解析
14:25
I put a little bit of lemon juice in it and a little bit of water. So it was the size of a shot, like two ounces. And that I could go goop and get down, even though it was disgusting. And I didn't have to drink eight ounces or 12 ounces. So, you know, you add that to your product mix so people can do that. Yeah. So these products were still racemic. What does that mean? So it has… 语法解析
14:47
molecules that have different functional groups, they're basically handed. So even your hands have the same ingredients, they have the same fingers, right? You can never, in space, you can never align them. 语法解析
14:58
So you can never put your two hands, even if you now are trying, right? You can never put them on top of each other so they have the same orientation. They always have a different orientation in space and that's true for molecules as well. Now in the case of ketone bodies, this is certainly true. And if you want to make them the cheapest way synthetically, you will get 50% of the left, like the left hand and 50% of the right hand of the molecule. In the body, 语法解析
15:24
The most predominant one is the right-handed one. Now, it turns out that this racemic mix tastes much worse than the more human, humanly present right-handed molecule. So I think you might have keto force was tasting quite horrible for sure. I remember that version. Some of those are also very synthetically sweetened and stuff. If you try our versions, I think the flavoring is much better these days. It's not perfect. 语法解析
15:51
perfectly delicious, but it's certainly not like Keto Force or other products where you can't tolerate it. I mean, taste is subjective. Some love it, some don't like it, but it's certainly not as bad as a ketone ester or a very early brew. But what I'm saying is if something doesn't taste good and you have to have a lot of it, you know, you got to try to make it taste as good as possible so people can, they don't throw up. But in something truly horrible, you want to have a minimum amount of liquid as possible. So that's why like… 语法解析
16:17
at both ends of the spectrum. Some people I've seen, like myself, if it's a little bit of liquid, I'd rather that and it's awful rather than a lot of it and it's like, you know. So it's just… 语法解析
16:28
That's true. Now with ours, it's subjective how much flavor you want and how much sweetness. So what you can also do if it's too intense, you can just put it in one liter of water because it's not disgusting, but it may be too intense. And then some people find it more palatable. But going forward, once we're maybe a little more than a small startup and have a bit more funds and sales, we can also put it into capsules and then it's like no flavor at all. 语法解析
16:52
But I don't know, would you would you swallow 10 capsules a day or? That becomes another problem. That's why I'm suggesting, you know, for your product in the future, if you do no flavor, but minimal amount of water again, and maybe like a little bit of lemon juice, it's enough for it's like a disgusting margarita, but you can get it down and it's not as bad, you know? Again, like if you tell me if you gave me the trade off between something that tastes awful, that 语法解析
17:17
That's only two ounces versus something that tastes just bad. Eight ounces, I'd rather do the awful, you know, just to get it out of the way with a chaser or something, you know. And you can totally put it even in like a shot, even the current version, right? You decide how much water. If you want to chug it and you just put very little in, totally up to you. That's an option as well. And it's a good option. Actually, we should put that into our advice for people that really don't like the flavor. We also suggest adding lemon or ginger juice or some tart juices really help and having it cold. 语法解析
17:46
But just putting a shot, downing it is probably a very good idea as well. When should people have it though? Before they eat, after they eat? You know, what if they're going to eat a keto type meal? Okay, but what if they want ice cream and, you know, they're eating sugar, but they have the ketones with it. Wouldn't it be counterproductive? Like when should it be consumed? Yeah, that's a good question. Now with the carbs, the study we did was actually on a normal Western diet and they had carbs alongside it. Whether… 语法解析
18:14
This is the ideal state to do for years. It's a bit unclear. So what we know is that it lowers blood glucose, which raises the question, is it better to have ice cream and no brain ritual or ketone bodies, right? 语法解析
18:29
Or is it better to have ketone bodies and ice cream, even though it's not chronic, natural chronic state, but your blood sugar is still lower than it would without it? And there's one state in nature where this would have happened, right? So you would have high glucose, high insulin and high ketone bodies if we think 10,000 plus years ago when you're starving and 语法解析
18:49
And you're running away from a tiger. So in that instance, you have everything elevated. And that's where you're mentally the sharpest. So I can tell from my own experiments, like if you ever have a race or an exam or something where you need to function on your best cognitive function, right? Then it's actually interesting to combine exogenous ketone bodies with some sources of carbs. We see that also in professional athletes, right? 语法解析
19:15
Trials were not positive anymore. If they would in the race or whatever, they would just use the ketones. You would have to have some sort of carbs as well. So ketones 语法解析
19:25
So ketone bodies burn the best or fat burns the best in the presence of some carbs or glucose. That's just a fact. That's not, I mean, you're not always chronically running away from a tiger, right? Why would that happen? I thought that, you know, like everyone, when they talk about ketones, they always talk about switching from one type of, you know, metabolism to another. And that's wrong. That's wrong because you're not, I mean, it's just, it's just a metaphor, right? Because you are switching from the male. You are… 语法解析
19:52
But you're always doing both at the same time. They never tell you that if you don't have glucose, you're dead. You're always burning glucose and ketone bodies at the same time. Your brain needs 30 to 40% of energy from glucose always if you're starving or not. So the body can make some glucose for that reason, right? You always need both. You will always do both, but you may be switching from, let's say, the main… 语法解析
20:17
caloric or the main ATP production may come from fat rather than from carbohydrates, for example. So you're switching maybe the main source, but you're always doing both at the same time. Always. So that's interesting. You do a lot. Like, how are you not… 语法解析
20:34
doing either or. No, you're always doing both. No, the question is, well, if you're on a standard American diet, you also will most likely, not always, but most of us would still produce a minuscule amount of ketone bodies, even on a high carb diet. So even in that instance, you're doing both, but very limited and maybe not in an adequate way. So 语法解析
20:56
And you are on ketone bodies and glucose at the same time? Absolutely, yes. 100%. What you're really doing is you're just changing the ratio of ketones to glucose at a given time. So have you dialed that back and forth to see what's the optimal? Are there multiple set points? Exactly. 语法解析
21:15
That will give you a different function. Yeah, excellent question. And that you can do with exogenous ketones, right? If you do it with diet, it's very hard to control the ratio because you don't know. So there's so many things that will change endogenous production. If you're stressed, if you haven't slept, if you have a virus, right? Your body will inhibit ketone body production because cortisol goes up. Whenever cortisol or adrenaline go up, then blood glucose goes up, right? 语法解析
21:41
And so there's so many things, or even you might be reacting to dairy or even if it's cheese, right, on a ketogenic diet. There's so many things that may impact how much ketone bodies you are making and actually using. With exogenous ketones, you can change the ratio. 语法解析
21:56
Now, what's the optimal ratio? I would always recommend that. This shouldn't sound like I'm recommending ice cream and ketone bodies together, right? The safest way is to not eat those at the same time. I always recommend a low glycemic index whole foods diet, right? Eat real food whenever you can. 语法解析
22:12
Now, I'm not against that sweet potato or those fruit or if you can tolerate it, right? Everyone's slightly different. So whatever is best for you, but certainly whole foods. Now, with ketone bodies, I think it depends. If you are a perfect carbohydrate burner… 语法解析
22:27
and you've genetically adapted to live on whole food carbs and that's fine maybe you don't get any benefit of a surplus of ketones at all right so your ratio is maybe 95 carbs and 5 ketone bodies anybody does fine with that i mean that's wrong because you will still get some energy from fatty acids so let's ignore that right just in terms of that ratio that's oversimplified i just want to say that some nerds that are listening to the genius podcast might call me out otherwise 语法解析
22:55
But then it depends, like, how much does your brain and your cells actually, how much have they adapted to glucose metabolism? And if you have problems with the glucose transport or maybe fighting the oxidative stress that's produced when you burn glucose or glucose absorption, maybe with insulin, insulin resistance, right? There's so many different pathways where glucose metabolism could be suboptimal. And this can be genetically or acquired. 语法解析
23:22
And then you want to, that energy deficiency that results, you might want to replace with ketone bodies. Now, for some persons, say a mild migraine patient, very infrequent migraines, that might be 7%. For a severe dementia patient that has type 3 diabetes in the brain, you know, insulin resistance, that number might go up to 60% that we need to replace, you know? So I think it's going to be a very, very big continuum on… 语法解析
23:50
depending on genetics and environment of a given person. And maybe someday we'll get there that a person can tweak how much of exogenous ketones they're taking instead of the glucose for the brain. So ideally, these should be taken right before a meal or right after a meal? Like what, any difference post-prandial or pre-prandial? Yeah, so absorption is fine either way. It depends on how… 语法解析
24:15
how robust your GI tract is. Because there's a lot of nutrients and ketone bodies and minerals, they also have a light laxative effect. So if you're very sensitive, don't take it before meal because then you'll get diarrhea. Then just take it after meal or sip it throughout the day. If you have a robust stomach, you're used to nutrients or you've titrated in, if you adapted to these ingredients, then you can also take it faster in the morning, no problem. So I can take it whenever it doesn't mess me up. But the good news is that absorption is really good 语法解析
24:44
irrespective of whether you take it before or after a meal. It doesn't matter. So you can really… You said it brought down your migraines. And I know that, you know, we'll talk about cancer later, but at least for migraines, did you notice that it worked either way? Or like, what was the protocol that worked for you? Yeah. So to be honest, for me, I was very quickly, maybe at the beginning, but I was very quickly adapting to the nutrient load. 语法解析
25:10
So I was not religiously taking it either before or after. I tried to take some in the morning and afternoon, but I wouldn't religiously follow it like always before or after. Sometimes I would put it in my bottle and take it to work, you know, or take it to uni. And then I'd have half of it before and half of it after breakfast. 语法解析
25:29
Sometimes I'm at home on weekends, right? I would maybe sip it throughout the morning or I would chug it before I leave, right? It didn't matter, but I would have to do it in a sense religiously that for me personally, for two and a half years, I had to be in some degree of ketosis every day. Otherwise, the migraine came back full force. So I tried to stop and or go on a high carb diet and stop the exogenous ketone bodies and the micronutrients and so on. And the migraines came back. 语法解析
25:57
like pretty quickly. Now interestingly after two and a half years I do no longer need to take it even though I'm on like a low GI I eat carbs. I occasionally take it to fill up my reserves to retain metabolic flexibility so my body still knows what ketone bodies are and if I'm like stressed or if I need to 语法解析
26:17
perform better or just because I know it's good for me, I still take it, but nowhere religiously. Just what was important for me is that I really needed to take it every day, ideally twice a day to keep the migraines at bay in my case, or to support my brain energy. Now that you have this product though, what feedback are you getting from the users of it? What seems to be the ideal protocol for people? Are there multiple or just one? Yeah, so there is… 语法解析
26:42
The answer is it really depends. Now, it was designed to be taken twice a day, morning and afternoon. Now, some can take it whenever because they're robust, but some really have gastrointestinal issues and those are the ones that take it after the meal or they sip it through the day. And we have some that are either so gastrointestinal sensitive that only take one sachet and they 语法解析
27:04
And they do okay. And we have some that are more like light frequency myoviners that also only take it once a day or they take one sachet half in the morning, half in the afternoon. What seems to be very common is that you need to ramp it up. So we recommend that you do three days with just half a sachet. Then you do two halves morning and afternoon for another three to four days. 语法解析
27:25
then you do one and a half and then when you're fine then then you go to the full tomb sachet so that's something that's also not important for everyone but important for quite a few people to give your body a chance to get used to everything because you have to remember most western people today the last time they've had quiescent bodies in their system is when they were born and maybe during the time they were breastfed if they were breastfed and that at least that was my case and after that 语法解析
27:51
We'll put on a Western diet. We don't make any ketone bodies at all. So the body takes some time to press the transport system, the enzymes, that we can use those molecules again. It's all still there, right? But it's a bit like an IKEA manual for ketone bodies, transporters and enzymes and so on. They're all stuck together if you haven't used them in 30 years or whatever it may be, right? So then you need to slowly unwind. 语法解析
28:14
unglue the pages to finally find the right instructions to, and in this case, like the genetics, right, to basically be able to produce that again in sufficient quantities. So that's the keto adaptation period that you might have heard before. Who should have this and who should not? Sounds like migraine sufferers, so help them. But, you know, are there any people that should not do this for whatever reason? Yeah, that's an excellent question. And nothing works for everyone, right? 语法解析
28:40
So we say one thing that we found in our research is that there may be a subgroup of migraine that we term metabolic migraine. These are the subgroups where the migraine is warning them. Pain is always a warning signal, right? So we need to figure out what is it warning you from. And in some patients, it's warning you from either a lack of micronutrients or antioxidants or an energy deficiency or too much oxidative stress. We call these metabolic migraineurs. And 语法解析
29:06
designed for them. Now, who shouldn't have this? Basically, um, 语法解析
29:10
And this metabolic migraine is what the product is designed for, where a root cause of their migraine is suboptimal energy metabolism or nutrient deficiency, right? Or molecular deficiency, not enough energy in the brain, too much oxidative stress. These are the people that are responders. Now, from our research, this is around 30 to 40 percent of migraine patients. So not everyone, but then even for the ones where 语法解析
29:35
This is not a poor problem. It's just good for you ingredients, right? So you basically do something good for yourself or your brain in any case. But if your migraines are mainly hormonal, so they appear just before your period only, right? And nowhere else, you might be better off seeing a bioidentical hormone specialist, for example. Now, who shouldn't take this product? If you have uncontrolled type 1 diabetes and you're often in very high ketosis due to not having any insulin, this isn't a good idea. 语法解析
30:04
If you have any inborn metabolism diseases, inborn disorders of fat metabolism, for example, not for you either, but that you would know. That's very rare. And if you have severe kidney failure, also not for you because of all the minerals in there. So those are the main contraindications. And then ideally, I mean, a medical food is ideally taken under medical supervision. So I don't know what drugs people are on. Sometimes for thyroid, you have to take it away 30 minutes from thyroid medication, so 语法解析
30:33
So you don't inhibit the absorption. So if you're on medication or you have any other difficulties, it's always better, no matter, even with like supplement, right? It's always better to talk to your doctor if you make any drastic changes or introduce anything that could have an interaction with any of your diseases or your medications that you're taking. What about the liver? So I guess you're saying most people's livers are not used to making ketones at all. What happens when you start taking this stuff? Does it… 语法解析
31:01
I don't know. Does it even further suppress ketone production because the body says we're getting in exogenously, we don't need to make it? Or what happens? That's a great question. So, well, personally, the ingredients in Brain Ritual are designed in such a way that they're human identical and ready to go. So your liver does not need to do much. A lot of supplements or products with nutrients have cheap and 语法解析
31:24
inactive versions of minerals, vitamins, electrolytes, and so on. So your liver still needs to do some work. We try to avoid that. So your liver should be in the clear. 语法解析
31:35
Now, is there a negative feedback loop like with hormones? There is, yes. But you have to get to a really high level. So you have to go to about 5 millimole in the blood for your body to turn on insulin. Secretion and insulin then inhibits endogenous ketone body production. Now, with our products, single dose, you get to around 1, right? So on average, right? And this is also… 语法解析
32:01
It varies a lot on how much you absorb it and how quickly you get into your cells and so on. But let's say on average one millimole, that means nowhere close to inhibiting your own production. Yeah, it's not easy to get above like one, one and a half millimoles with diet. 语法解析
32:15
Or with even the exogenous ketones, like you got to take a lot. Exactly. And by the time you take so much, you will throw up and you get so much diarrhea, you know? I mean, it's almost impossible to overdose. I'm not going to suggest to try, anyone try this, right? So please don't. But yeah, it's very hard to kill yourself with exogenous ketone bodies. It's easier to do that with ibuprofen, to be honest. And so I think that these are quite safe. They have a mechanism of controlling. But 语法解析
32:41
But say if you have an uncontrolled type 1 diabetes, right, where you're not making insulin and your insulin pump is broken and you're already endogenously at 6, 7 or whatever, don't want to put another millimole on top of that. That's why we say if your type 1 diabetes is not under control, maybe don't do it. What do people experience, you know, once they take it in their first few minutes, maybe the first half hour? No. On average, what we found is that it takes about 语法解析
33:10
about two weeks, two to three weeks for migraineurs, for the average migraineur to feel a difference. This is the time you need to build up, as we said, like all this genetic changes, transport system. For people that have been in ketosis before or that have lactate present, right, so they already have the transporters and enzymes, they can 语法解析
33:31
they can already feel the first sachet actually. So we had patients even take it acutely, which it wasn't designed for, that have been in ketosis via diet or otherwise. And they basically, the migraine was gone in like two hours. We've had those. We've had people with headache actually experience a very similar thing, or even with headaches during an infection where they reported a positive response. Now these are anecdotal data, right? We want to say that we 语法解析
33:55
We've had people where it takes a bit longer, but we've had literally chronic migraine patients that have been migraine-free for eight weeks in a row. We've had somebody with migraine and bipolar reporting that bipolar got better as well. We have a depressed person getting off all of her antidepressant medication. These are rare, right? These are just anecdotes of people that are writing us from the extreme cases. 语法解析
34:20
But we also had one diabetic patient that was able to go off all her diabetes medications, probably because of the blood sugar lowering effect and maybe improvements of metabolism. So these are just some side effects that we see or some side anecdotal data on people that… 语法解析
34:38
have something else than migraine, but it's mainly formulated, it is formulated for migraine and that's the only indication that we are selling it for yet. I know it's hard because each indication needs separate clinical trials. So like progression versus migraine versus what about cancer? You know, from ketogenic diet has been spoken about for cancer. Do you 语法解析
34:58
Do you think that this may have a positive impact on it? Yeah, so cancer is always hard to comment on. So when you are on traditional cancer medications, one thing that happens is you're increasing oxidative stress, for sure. So you want to kill the cancer, but you also kind of want to keep your healthy cells alive. So this can be an issue. Now, MycoCat or Brain Ritual, as the product's called now, has a lot of micronutrients in there that can… 语法解析
35:24
definitely probably help the healthy cells battle with this oxidative stress and give them extra nutrients but i'm not sure it may also potentially fuel the cancer a bit on the other hand we have so this is kind of a this is somewhere where you have to be yeah the risk benefit is it's always hard with cancer but on the other side you have blood sugar lowering most cancers that's 语法解析
35:47
Not all, but most cancers cannot metabolize ketone bodies. So you have an alternative energy for your healthy cells while you reduce the glucose that the cancers are primarily relying on. So in that sense, exogenous ketone bodies I know have been used, have been used quite successfully, but not as a single solution. This is more as support, right? To lower blood sugar further, to get ketone body levels up higher, to help with the side effects of maybe radiation or chemotherapy and so 语法解析
36:16
It's depending on the cancer. You have to say that. That's for sure. And you do want to with cancer. It's not like with these neuropsychiatric diseases, it's in part an energy deficiency that we're treating, right? So I don't think everybody has to be on a very strict ketogenic diet. Now with cancer… 语法解析
36:34
we are treating a surplus of energy. So the cancer cell, it need to be, I know starvation is a bit simple, but they need to be, we need to deprive them of glucose. So in cancer, you absolutely need to be on a low carb ketogenic diet. When you have exogenous ketones, 语法解析
36:52
or ketones in general, or exogenous, how does it become competitive with glucose uptake? And if so, how? There must be a way to do it, you know, again, before or after the meal. I don't know. There must be some way to do it where it'd be more competitive than otherwise. There is a competition when it comes to what is burned first, right? In the gut and elsewhere, they have different transport system. But there is absolutely a hierarchy of what is burned first, right? And then whatever… 语法解析
37:19
you have access is put into fat stores. So interestingly, there is research to suggest that ketone bodies are in the brain, the preferred energy source. So the brain will prevent, preferentially burn the ketone bodies first and then more of the glucose. I mean, there's always some parallel, right? But it seems like ketone bodies are preferred for brain and potentially for the heart. Now, in terms of uptake in the gut, it's a good question. I think there's different 语法解析
37:46
Mostly the uptake is different transport system. So you can probably take them up together. But what ketone bodies do, and this is why they're so potent here, is they seem to inhibit gluconeogenesis in the liver. Gluconeogenesis is when we make new glucose, right? So it's turning off our own glucose production, which then lowers glucose levels, even though the same amount is coming in from the outside. So this is good, but… 语法解析
38:12
If you still eat high amount of carbs, it won't be good enough for the cancer. Because the cancer will ferment foods. So they will ferment carbohydrates and they will ferment glucose and they will ferment glutamine as well. What does that mean? A healthy cell makes most of the energy in the so-called mitochondria, which are the powerhouse of the cells, ancient bacteria, right? So there you shuttle your fatty acid, your ketone body or your glucose into that and then you make… 语法解析
38:40
If you're healthy, 36 ATPs out of that. There's an ancient way to also make energy, which is what cancer cells mostly do. And that's called glycolysis, which means we're just splitting up glucose inside of the cell, not the mitochondria, in the cytoplasm. And we have a net positive of around 4 ATP. It's much less energy effective, which is why cancer people also oftentimes lose weight because these cancer cells… 语法解析
39:07
They really eat a lot of glucose so they can eat what they want. They don't get weight, but the cancer cell is growing fast. So if you use ketone bodies, they cannot be burned in the cytoplasm, the hetero, in the mitochondria, which in many cancer cells, that's broken. So the cancer cell will thrive on glucose and glutamine. 语法解析
39:27
the amino acids. So that's why it's, in my opinion, mostly necessary to really cut down on carbohydrates and glucose when you have cancer. And then exogenous may be an additional tool for sure to drop glucose even lower and get more energy for the other healthy cells. Well, for the average person, maybe the best plan, if they don't have cancer, but just for health, is to do this with every meal. Have a little bit of the ketones with every meal. So when the carbs are present, 语法解析
39:56
There's also the ketones present. What's your note on that protocol? Or have it between meals, right? So that you are lowering the glucose and you have a period where you are basically more ketotic and then you have a period where you rely on carbs more. So 语法解析
40:12
So you keep that metabolic flexibility. You have some states where you're burning more carbohydrates and you have some states where you have a degree of ketosis, which I think if you're healthy enough, that's what we were like 10,000 years back, right? We would have enough micronutrients because the water was still mineral water, you know, the spring water. You 语法解析
40:32
You would have all the right nutrients still in your plants and in your fruit, vegetables, whatever, with a different world. And you would naturally have times where you have fruit and roots and whatever available. And then you would have times where you have more meat and fat and maybe some leaves or whatever available in winter. So I think that our ancestors would go out of periods of time 语法解析
40:56
ketosis and carbohydrate metabolism very easily. And that's what metabolic flexibility really is. So as an analogy, we could say 10,000 plus years back, we would all be hybrid cars. We could use electricity and petrol whenever we needed to. We could switch back and forth, whatever was there, right? Today, we're all electric cars. We all rely on glucose only. We 语法解析
41:18
We need to find a plug every like two, three hours. We can't store energy very well and we're super inflexible. And that's, I think, what needs to be changed. We need to bring, in general, we need to even, I think most, not all people, some are perfectly doing 语法解析
41:33
doing perfectly well with glucose metabolism mainly. But I think most of us or many of us should bring back at least some periods of where ketone bodies are present. And this can be done with intermittent fasting. You know, you do this 16-8, maybe have some ketones there, or you could have some ketones in between meals if you're healthy, right? Or you could have some low-carb. Some people do like a low-carb breakfast, right? Have 语法解析
41:57
You have your eggs and bacon, and then you only introduce carbs in the evening or at lunchtime. Or you have a couple of days a week where you have less carbs so that you gain this metabolic flexibility back. For those that are pretty broken, it's really hard to do that. So that's where like the crutch brain ritual comes in, right? Or exogenous ketones in general. Because you need to relearn everything. I wasn't, even like when I was fasting… 语法解析
42:22
I wasn't getting in ketosis forever because my body didn't remember how to make any of this stuff. If you have real trouble fasting, right, I would say don't force yourself. Ease into it. Listen to your body. Maybe add some exogenous ketones at first for your body to re-acclimatize and remember, right? And then it should get easier over time. Well, maybe it's not forgetting. Maybe the metabolic pathways are methylated over or something. Exactly there. 语法解析
42:49
They're not completely forgotten. They're just hidden. And yeah, it's the pages are stuck together. Something you might want to look at is evaluate, get a baseline microbiome on somebody and then have them take this for a while. Because you said like two weeks for some people to get acclimatized. 语法解析
43:04
It could be that what's happening is it takes two weeks for certain bacteria to appear in the gut. Because of the ketones, and maybe there's a short-chain fatty acid or some metabolite they're producing that allows this to work. So you might want to look at what's happening to the microbiome as you've been on this for a while. Super interesting, because actually there's some research in epilepsy that suggests that the success of a ketogenic diet in epilepsy is to a very large extent 语法解析
43:32
extent dependent on changes on the microbiome. So it's really one of the key drivers of the effect is that the microbiome adapts. And what is interesting is that beta-hydroxybutyrate, the main ingredient of brain ritual, their ketone body, is very close to butyrate. Butyrate is that short-chain fatty acids that a healthy gut bacteria produces for the brain and that also the endothelial cells of the gut lining and also needs to function well. They need that as an energy source, right? 语法解析
44:00
So in that sense, it may very well be that there's very positive effects on the microbiome that we haven't studied personally, but that I know are taking place in children with epilepsy on a ketogenic diet, for example, and I think also in other patient populations that have been studied. So this may very well be part of the effect. 语法解析
44:19
And the microbiome potential, because the microbiome is a factory, it's good, right? It's a factory for bioactive vitamins, short-chain fatty acids, so for nutrients for the brain. So a lot of nutrients that the brain needs are actually made in the gut. 语法解析
44:33
Is ketone metabolism understood? You know, what are the, you know, the products that it breaks down into? Like the, you know, all the steps of it. I mean, oxidative phosphorylation fermentation seemed to be understood, but again, what about ketone metabolism? Maybe there it would point to, oh, look, there 语法解析
44:49
There's this molecule that cleaves it and makes the butyrate. So it like dovetails into that normal path of what the brain needs. Is it fully understood? I mean, we do know, I think one pathway is how it's like turned into this coenzyme A and then that's not my speciality and then burn the Krebs cycle, right? The C's are taking off and then in the end it's CO2 and water. But there may be a pathway exactly as you say, right, where it's like maybe 语法解析
45:16
Maybe the hydroxy group is taken off somewhere and it's turning to butyrate. Who knows? Could be true. I mean, maybe somebody knows. If anybody listening does, I would be interested to hear that as well. 语法解析
45:27
Well, I'm sure I don't know, but that doesn't mean it doesn't, it's not possible. Or we as humans don't know, or as the field. So it's a good point. And it's really just a field that has gained interest in the last 10 or so years, right? Dominic D'Agostino was one of the first ones. He was my external PhD supervisor in 2004. I've interviewed Dom. He's a great character. Oh, you know Dom? Yeah, I met him at a metabolic health summit and I've interviewed him a few times. Hey, I was a speaker there. 语法解析
45:55
a couple of years back and I was there from the first one. First one. Still packing boxes, you know. I was in the back helping. I know Angela Poff quite well. Yep. I met all of them. How cool. Yeah, and Patrick Arnold, right? He was the one who gave me the first exogenous ketone buddies. Keto Kana at the time. Yeah, that's right. That's why I asked Dom to try Keto Force. Because I said, is there one with no flavor? He's like, you're not going to like it, but try it. Yes. Oh, God. Yeah, Keto Force was… 语法解析
46:24
At the time, the worst in terms of flavor. Keto Kano was easier to ingest, even not delicious. Oh, great. You know Dom, Angela, Metabolic. Yeah, I will definitely… Last one was the only one I missed because it was sick. But most likely… Yeah, I met Thomas Seyfried there and a whole bunch of peoples. Oh, would you like that kind of thing? I'm not sure that's a place. You should come to Keto Life in Switzerland. It's the most beautiful keto and metabolism conference that… 语法解析
46:51
you'll ever be at in St. Moritz. I'm sure you'd love it. I mean, it's worth far travel. That does sound great though. Yeah. I'll ask you about that offline. That's excellent. Yeah. For right now, we're out of time, but it's great talking to you. So where can people get these products? You know, let's point them to where they can go shop. They need help. Yeah. So the products are available at brainritual.com. Fairly easy. But then also Instagram. 语法解析
47:16
If you want to just learn more about metabolism and migraine, migraine metabolism, what oxidative stress is, what you can do, I developed like a four-pillar model on how to improve metabolism and migraine with or without. I mean, the spring ritual feeds into these four pillars, but complete free information. I made a YouTube course. There's a paper on how to do that in lay people's language. So hopefully easy to understand. You can find all of this at drelenagrowes.com. 语法解析
47:44
So my name dot com. And yeah, there's a lot of free information. And also I'm on Instagram and all the social medias with lots of information completely free. So either the brain ritual or that will give you some information. Well, very good. Well, it's been great to talk to you. And thank you so much for coming on. I appreciate it. It was great to talk to you, too. Thank you so much. It was a pleasure. If you like this podcast, please click the link in the description to subscribe and review us on iTunes. 语法解析
48:15
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48:35
This podcast is for information only. No advice of any kind is being given. Any action you take or don't take as a result of listening is your sole responsibility. Consult professionals when advice is needed. 语法解析
Edit:2025.04.04